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	<title>Comments on: Cartography is dead, long live the map makers</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/</link>
	<description>The blog of Ed Parsons, Geographer.</description>
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		<title>By: Richard Fairhurst</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1473</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Fairhurst</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Sep 2008 22:04:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1473</guid>
		<description>I keep meaning to write a long, long blog post about this yet haven&#039;t got round to it yet (well, I did start one, but it was way too potty-mouthed even by my standards).

But I can&#039;t quite believe the venom directed here at the OS 1:50k. Single best cartography in the world, bar none. And if OS 1:25k is so great how come that it (in Explorer form) isn&#039;t offered via OpenSpace?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I keep meaning to write a long, long blog post about this yet haven&#8217;t got round to it yet (well, I did start one, but it was way too potty-mouthed even by my standards).</p>
<p>But I can&#8217;t quite believe the venom directed here at the OS 1:50k. Single best cartography in the world, bar none. And if OS 1:25k is so great how come that it (in Explorer form) isn&#8217;t offered via OpenSpace?</p>
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		<title>By: Anthony Fryer</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1472</link>
		<dc:creator>Anthony Fryer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:45:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1472</guid>
		<description>I am another that has to stick up for OS maps at 1:25k. Great looking maps and a work of art for the fine detail that goes into them. Can happily sit at night and read a map, and plan and visualize my long weekend run in the mountains. There is a bit too much detail sometimes, especially in rocky terrain.  The 1:50k falls down with not enough detail. 

No mention of the Harveys 1:40k maps. The (relatively) new people on the scene. The Harvey BMC mountain maps are great! They fit the balance nicely between enough outdoor detail, but also the scale is large enough not to have reams of paper flapping around.

What is needed is more &quot;free&quot; online OS or Harvey&#039;s mapping apps. Mimicking the currently expensive mapping software from anquet and memory map. These work well and are very popular so why wouldn&#039;t properly created online apps. 

There is a trend towards mapping your sports activities and OS are missing this boat and letting others take the lead especially google maps)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am another that has to stick up for OS maps at 1:25k. Great looking maps and a work of art for the fine detail that goes into them. Can happily sit at night and read a map, and plan and visualize my long weekend run in the mountains. There is a bit too much detail sometimes, especially in rocky terrain.  The 1:50k falls down with not enough detail. </p>
<p>No mention of the Harveys 1:40k maps. The (relatively) new people on the scene. The Harvey BMC mountain maps are great! They fit the balance nicely between enough outdoor detail, but also the scale is large enough not to have reams of paper flapping around.</p>
<p>What is needed is more &#8220;free&#8221; online OS or Harvey&#8217;s mapping apps. Mimicking the currently expensive mapping software from anquet and memory map. These work well and are very popular so why wouldn&#8217;t properly created online apps. </p>
<p>There is a trend towards mapping your sports activities and OS are missing this boat and letting others take the lead especially google maps)</p>
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		<title>By: Ed</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1471</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Sep 2008 14:55:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1471</guid>
		<description>Disappointing  but not surprising to see the OS position on the debate, http://leisure.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/leisure/tscontent/editorial/mapfacts/2008/papermaps303.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Disappointing  but not surprising to see the OS position on the debate, <a href="http://leisure.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/leisure/tscontent/editorial/mapfacts/2008/papermaps303.html" rel="nofollow">http://leisure.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/leisure/tscontent/editorial/mapfacts/2008/papermaps303.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: tim warr</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1470</link>
		<dc:creator>tim warr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 17:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1470</guid>
		<description>Ed,

There is nothing wrong with the OS 50k per se, the problem is nothing has been done to innovate its cartography for the last 20(?) years.  Which brings us back to the need for some fearless modernising cartographers... 

If it was automatically rendered it could be commercially viable.   Now I wonder if anyone thought of doing that at the OS...

Tim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ed,</p>
<p>There is nothing wrong with the OS 50k per se, the problem is nothing has been done to innovate its cartography for the last 20(?) years.  Which brings us back to the need for some fearless modernising cartographers&#8230; </p>
<p>If it was automatically rendered it could be commercially viable.   Now I wonder if anyone thought of doing that at the OS&#8230;</p>
<p>Tim</p>
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		<title>By: Ed</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1469</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 09:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1469</guid>
		<description>Tim,

I agree OS 1:25K maps are great for walkers and can work well online is displayed carefully, but Steven does also have a good point about 1:50K mapping. We both know from our time at the OS, is only exists because people are too afraid to kill it, it&#039;s really not useful for very much any more (1:25k has in effect replaced it), and cannot be commercial viable.

ed</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim,</p>
<p>I agree OS 1:25K maps are great for walkers and can work well online is displayed carefully, but Steven does also have a good point about 1:50K mapping. We both know from our time at the OS, is only exists because people are too afraid to kill it, it&#8217;s really not useful for very much any more (1:25k has in effect replaced it), and cannot be commercial viable.</p>
<p>ed</p>
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		<title>By: tim warr</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1468</link>
		<dc:creator>tim warr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 07:43:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1468</guid>
		<description>Steven,

I&#039;ve got to stick up for OS mapping here!  

OK it does not look  great at the wrong scale in web mapping apps - but it is still the UK&#039;s favourite mapping (Multimap certainly got a lot of complaints when there was a brief period without OS mapping on the site).  Remember a lot of people still use web mapping sites to go and print a map of an area of interest and look to OS mapping as a familiar cartography.  

Go for a hike somewhere else in Europe and you will soon be missing your excuisite manual cartography on OS 1:25k.

Tim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steven,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve got to stick up for OS mapping here!  </p>
<p>OK it does not look  great at the wrong scale in web mapping apps &#8211; but it is still the UK&#8217;s favourite mapping (Multimap certainly got a lot of complaints when there was a brief period without OS mapping on the site).  Remember a lot of people still use web mapping sites to go and print a map of an area of interest and look to OS mapping as a familiar cartography.  </p>
<p>Go for a hike somewhere else in Europe and you will soon be missing your excuisite manual cartography on OS 1:25k.</p>
<p>Tim</p>
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		<title>By: steven feldman</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1467</link>
		<dc:creator>steven feldman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 08:32:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1467</guid>
		<description>Cartography does matter. 

Just imagine the response if Google took the moderately well rendered stack of TeleAtlas maps out of GM and replaced them with a stack that contained OS 1:250k mini scale, 1:50k Raster (very possibly the ugliest map ever), StreetView and 1:10k Raster. People would respond with a yuck!!! The attractive maps are one of the reasons that people preferred GM to MultiMap or Streetmap.co.uk

Have a look at the styling of the maps in OSM and you will see what can be achieved with good styling.

Cartographers need to focus their skills on the way information is presented on the web rather than bemoaning the decline of paper maps.

Steven</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cartography does matter. </p>
<p>Just imagine the response if Google took the moderately well rendered stack of TeleAtlas maps out of GM and replaced them with a stack that contained OS 1:250k mini scale, 1:50k Raster (very possibly the ugliest map ever), StreetView and 1:10k Raster. People would respond with a yuck!!! The attractive maps are one of the reasons that people preferred GM to MultiMap or Streetmap.co.uk</p>
<p>Have a look at the styling of the maps in OSM and you will see what can be achieved with good styling.</p>
<p>Cartographers need to focus their skills on the way information is presented on the web rather than bemoaning the decline of paper maps.</p>
<p>Steven</p>
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		<title>By: Grady Meehan</title>
		<link>http://www.edparsons.com/2008/09/cartography-is-dead-long-live-the-map-makers/#comment-1466</link>
		<dc:creator>Grady Meehan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 16:39:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.edparsons.com/?p=522#comment-1466</guid>
		<description>Traditional cartography generally focused on printing technologies and methods of getting maps printed on paper, using many methods and standards developed during the 16th century and later. Until approximately three decades ago, cartography was entrenched in the printing and publishing domain.

Computer-generated map-making technology emerged in the 1985-1995 period following developments from 1965-1985. When government agencies switched from map scribing and plate-making for printing to the use of computer-generated graphical representations, it marked the end of the old cartographic paradigm. It also marked the beginning of the current situation when new mapping developments expanded into many new markets outside government.

Traditional cartographers generally switched to a GIS focus or, in some cases, retired. The fundamentals of cartography transitioned to digital mapping and GIS software, so that many of the principles of cartography were applied using algorithms rather than by the acquired skills of the cartographer. 

The reality today is that GIS greatly lowered the cost of making maps and created many new geographic visualization opportunities. Map making functions moved into the mainstream of information-based technology and away from older printing technologies. In making the transition, the knowledge and skills of data manipulation, data analysis and geo-visualization pushed the mapping knowledge domain into the IT and management domains. Knowledge of how to organize complex geospatial data and communicate its meaning still requires advanced geographic knowledge of geospatial organization and graphic representation. Many online mash-ups are basically push-pin maps created using little geographic knowledge, but provide great value to many users.

By ignoring trends outside their field, cartographers slow-to-change attitudes led to their own decline. Other examples show that elevator operators were replaced by a panel of buttons and complex map printing technologies have been replace by the print button on a graphic browser interface. The world has moved on for the better, I believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Traditional cartography generally focused on printing technologies and methods of getting maps printed on paper, using many methods and standards developed during the 16th century and later. Until approximately three decades ago, cartography was entrenched in the printing and publishing domain.</p>
<p>Computer-generated map-making technology emerged in the 1985-1995 period following developments from 1965-1985. When government agencies switched from map scribing and plate-making for printing to the use of computer-generated graphical representations, it marked the end of the old cartographic paradigm. It also marked the beginning of the current situation when new mapping developments expanded into many new markets outside government.</p>
<p>Traditional cartographers generally switched to a GIS focus or, in some cases, retired. The fundamentals of cartography transitioned to digital mapping and GIS software, so that many of the principles of cartography were applied using algorithms rather than by the acquired skills of the cartographer. </p>
<p>The reality today is that GIS greatly lowered the cost of making maps and created many new geographic visualization opportunities. Map making functions moved into the mainstream of information-based technology and away from older printing technologies. In making the transition, the knowledge and skills of data manipulation, data analysis and geo-visualization pushed the mapping knowledge domain into the IT and management domains. Knowledge of how to organize complex geospatial data and communicate its meaning still requires advanced geographic knowledge of geospatial organization and graphic representation. Many online mash-ups are basically push-pin maps created using little geographic knowledge, but provide great value to many users.</p>
<p>By ignoring trends outside their field, cartographers slow-to-change attitudes led to their own decline. Other examples show that elevator operators were replaced by a panel of buttons and complex map printing technologies have been replace by the print button on a graphic browser interface. The world has moved on for the better, I believe.</p>
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